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Motor-Elektrik

 

 

 

 

 

basic information on problems
with battery charging

in July 2021

 

hi folks,

 

at some point the battery is suddenly no longer charged,

which stupidly you only get to feel

when you turn on the ignition, press the start button and the starter hardly turns or does not turn at all or the fuel pump no longer makes a sound when the key is turned to ignition ON.

If the pump is still "loud" and hums softly, you still have a small chance of being able to push the Haya / let it roll down the mountain.

But if the humming of the fuel pump does not happen when the ignition key is turned, the fun is over.

Now, if at all, only so-called "external current" via a jumper cable helps.

 

But the problem is there - the battery is either simply defective because it is too old, or, which is now more common especially with the Gen1, the charging voltage is no longer sufficient to run the battery as well as the normal operation of the motorcycle and its power requirements ) to load.

 

This problem occurs suddenly and without any warning and nothing can help it - it just happens.

Only a volt meter, permanently installed and connected directly to the battery poles, can indicate that something is wrong with the charging voltage while driving.

 

The following procedure is now imperative: (whether at home or in a workshop)

Mandatory requirements here:

- Sufficient patience and calm when screwing!

- no matter which plug (regulator) you pull
ALWAYS the ignition OFF !

 

What you should have available to be on the safe side:

A controller that is 100% safe and intact

B a 100% safe intact LiMa

 

To work:

 

1.a   remove the battery and charge it completely until the charger switches to trickle charging, then switch the charger off and measure the voltage of the battery
- it should be around 13.5 v.

1.b   then, in order to be able to roughly estimate the capacity, simply leave the battery for 24 hours and measure the voltage again after the 24 hours.

1.c   if it is now at 12.4 - 12.6 v, the battery is still "good", i.e.  not too old and still able to hold voltage.

if the voltage is below 12.3 v or even lower, the battery is “over” and a new one has to be found.

1.d   but be careful - before any further work, even this new battery must first be connected to the charger for 24 hours so that it has the necessary 100% charge in order to be able to guarantee the further work steps.

2.      completely dismantle the rear fairing as well, because you have to work there too.

3.      unscrew the controller and its mounting plate and let it hang down by its cables

4.a.  pull the 6-way plug of the controller apart and check it all around for melted or even melted plastic and, for safety's sake, also the 5 cables from the plug to the controller for hardening.

is it very likely so,

4.b.  also check the short piece of the three yellow cables to behind the controller, whether they also look charred or whether the insulation is so hardened that it breaks when the cable is bent.

5.      tank up and check the 3-way plug connection on the left under the tank with sufficient light

5.a   the two plugs themselves also have melted or even melted away plastic

5.b   the cables on both sides still have their full insulation - until they enter the connector or are hardened or even "burned away"

both sides  because of the 3 yellow cables

5.c   coming from the controller may be damaged

5.d   coming from the gen can also be damaged

6.      if the problem from point 4 is present, it may be sufficient

6.a   simply cut off both the 5 cables in the soft area including the plug from the controller and replace them with a new one or 5 individual plugs and

6.b   and do the same thing on the wiring harness (in the rear)

7.      if the problems from 4.a & 4.b are also present in addition to the problems from 5.a & 5.c, i recommend that you also cut the gen´s connector and install a new connector.

in addition, 5 meters of yellow cable with a cross-section of (metric) 2.5² (not thinner!) plus 1.5 meters of cable hose, ø - 8mm, can be obtained from a good cable dealer, because now the wiring harness from the 3-way plug is under the tank up to the 6-way plug on the controller is strongly recommended.

 

The matching connector pairings are available from "xmas.at".
(Then simply cut off the 3-way connector under the tank just short of the main wiring harness and ditto the 6-way connector in the rear and both in the trash can.)

8.a Everything rewired and plugged together, you should now at least approximately measure the internal resistance in ohms (Ω) of the stator (on the new connector).

Three (3) measurements are necessary between the 3 yellow cables and ground (on the motor etc.) - the value should be between 0.2 - 0.4 Ω - then everything is OK so far and you can now

8.b Install the battery, start the engine and measure the charging voltage on the battery.

If the charging voltage is now 14.2 - 14.4 V with high beam ON and 5,000 rpm, everything is chic and you can (almost) reassemble the Haya.

 

However !

 There are three other possible hooks

9.a the function of the controller

9.b the idle span of the stator

9.c the behavior of the stator windings when heated

9.a If the charging voltage with high beam ON and 5,000 rpm (engine still cold) is not in the range of 14.2-14.4 V, the controller must be replaced.

So the engine / ignition off, plug in the replacement regulator, start the engine again and measure the charging voltage again.

9.b If the voltage is still not in the range of 14.2-14.4 V, the idle voltage must be measured between the 3 yellow cables (on the 3-way plug under the tank, for example)

            It must be above 65 V at 5,000 rpm (with a cold engine).

            If this is not the case, another stator is due.

ALWAYS switch the ignition OFF before pulling the 3-way plug apart!

 

9.c The stator windings can work perfectly as long as the motor is still at room temperature, ie is still "cold".

- But if the engine is warm and so hot that the fan of the water cooler starts, CAN! it happens that the charging voltage drops below 13.6 V or even less with high beam ON and 5,000 rpm.

- Then the effect has occurred, which is known from old ignition coils - if they are defective, i.e. they have a cable break in the winding, this cable break can expand (at the latest) when the temperature increases so that the current flow is interrupted and no ignition spark is produced will.

- Exactly the same effect can also occur on the LiMa, because even a single winding has a cable break, which still lets current through in the "cold" state, but nothing works in the "warm" state and the charging voltage on the battery collapses .

- So you should let the Hayabusa run until the fan turns on.

- Then the stator has also received plenty of heat and the charging voltage on the battery shows whether all windings are still OK (volts remain at 14.2-14.4) or whether there is a cable break due to the expansion caused by the heating shows in the stator.

Then it would be time to replace the stator and measure the charging voltage again.

10. If the stator has also been replaced (after the regulator), a new control measurement of the charging voltage is due.

a with the exchange regulator

b with the old regulator

then,

if the charging voltage with the old regulator and meanwhile warm engine is still at 14.2-14.4 V, this can be used further and the replacement regulator can be returned to the shelf or to the donor - the money can then be paid for yes save.

 

11. So far it was only about the insufficient charging voltage, because

w as it can also happen is the concern of excess voltage in the range from 14.9 V, ie 15 - 17 volts (and more).

In the long run, this is fatal for EVERY battery, regardless of whether it is lead / gel or even LiFePo.

But you can only notice this overvoltage if you have a volt meter permanently installed in the field of vision around the speedometer or you check the charging voltage on the battery every six months using (seat up and) an extra measuring device.

If the charging voltage is too high, the controller is simply defective and it must be replaced.

According to the experience of a former forum member, it is advisable to switch to the controller of the Honda XX (Blackbird) type SC 35 or 42, because it limits the charging voltage to a maximum of 14.5 volts with a built-in relay .

 

 

And remember:

ALWAYS ignition OFF!

- before changing the controller

- before pulling out the LiMa plug

 

__________________________________

 

 

Another sentence or two to the new battery.

The optimal charging voltage is 13.9-14.2 volts - regardless of the type of battery.

The only restriction is the maximum charging voltage - it should NEVER exceed 14.8-14.9 V.

The LiFePo4, which is now often used, should be defective after only 30-60 minutes of overvoltage (greater than 14.9 V).

All other lead / gel batteries are a little less susceptible - they can withstand a little more for a short time, but the 15 volt limit should never be exceeded permanently with them either - they suffer massively and are defective again very quickly .

 

all from above
here for the
Download
as *.pdf

 

ps:          please excuse some eventually bit weird translations – i´m german and i tried my best. J